Say It With Garage Flowers

Wry, observational singer-songwriter and author, Jim Bob, one half of ‘90s ‘punk Pet Shop Boys’ and indie-rockers, Carter the Unstoppable Sex Machine, is releasing two-brand new studio albums on the same day (August 22) – the full-band record, Automatic, and its dirtier, punkier cousin, Stick, which was made with a power three-piece.

To celebrate the release of both 11-track albums, Say It With Garage Flowers is running two interviews with Jim Bob.

This one focuses on Stick while the first chat, which is here, concentrates on Automatic.

“Stick is more old-fashioned – less polished. It’s like a Morris Minor Traveller, whereas Automatic is like a Lotus or something,” he explains.

 

Q&A

I’m assuming that you named the albums after types of cars: Automatic and Stick? Stick means manual – as in gear stick, but it’s not a common phrase these days…

Jim Bob: I thought everybody would know that, but then I have realised they don’t…

I had to look it up…

Jim Bob: Stick is more old-fashioned – less polished. It’s like a Morris Minor Traveller, whereas Automatic is like a Lotus or something…

So, let’s talk about Stick – it explores some of the themes that you sing about on Automatic, including war and escaping from the chaos of modern society.

I Will Still Be Here deals with the apocalypse – when all the world’s gone to shit, you’ll still be there for your partner, with wine in the fridge and her favourite snacks…

Jim Bob: Yeah – it’s like those sort of songs like Everybody Hurts [R.E.M.] and Lean On Me [Bill Withers]… You know – maybe everything’s shit, but you know you can rely on me, for what it’s worth.

I guess when the world’s going to hell in a handbasket, you can always take a walk in the park… which leads us rather nicely to I Go To The Park – a song about getting back to nature…

Jim Bob: I wanted to write songs quite quickly – about anything… Something I started doing this year was going to the park and walking, early in the morning – usually where there’d be a coffee shop at the end of it. I almost became addicted to it… If I didn’t go for a walk in the morning, I’d be a bit…

Was it the walking or the coffee you were addicted to?

Jim Bob: The walk, I think, but it could be both… I do find myself doing a lot of the same walks, like Dulwich Park – the walk there from my house is quite nice. Crystal Palace is close, but that’s massive and I have to walk along the main road to get there… So, it’s not just the park – it’s the journey to it. I think I could just sit there for hours – I’ve got a garden, but I don’t sit out there as much as I do in the park.

‘It’s probably one of the most outrageous puns I’ve written since Carter’

Do you come up with ideas for songs while you’re walking?

Jim Bob: Yeah – that’s the other reason for walking. So, I get ideas for lyrics when I’m at home, but most of them get written while I’m walking around…

Earlier, we talked about the apocalypse. You address it in the song (Oh What A) Shitshow – you sing about making an end-of-days playlist, and listening to Love Train or Heroes while the carousel turns, or sitting outside Caffè Nero and watching as Rome burn… I see what you did there – that’s a clever lyric…

Jim Bob: That’s probably one of the most outrageous puns I’ve written since Carter. All the worst people in the world – all the terrible leaders and dictators – are the kind of people that always look like they will cause the end of the world, but they’re obsessed by their own wealth, so maybe they’ll kill hundreds of people, but they’ll stop short of destroying the world.

‘I’m sure that’s what awful people, like dictators, are like – they bomb Gaza and then they go off and have lunch’

On Walk The Dog Start A War, you juxtapose everyday chores, like walking the dog, mowing the lawn and taking the bins out, with horrendous acts like starting a war, buying a gun, shooting up a village and ordering an air strike…

Jim Bob: I’m sure that’s what awful people, like dictators, are like – they bomb Gaza and then they go off and have lunch. It’s just another part of the day, isn’t it? That’s sort of the idea of the song – the same person that’s walking the dog and washing the car is also ordering an air strike on a village…

So, from everyday chores to being a pop star – there’s a song called The Last Night of the Tour on Stick. Did you enjoy touring in Carter and how do you feel about gigging now?

Jim Bob: It’s a lot different now – my memory of it was that I enjoyed it, especially the early years because it was exciting and different. When we were really successful, I enjoyed that less, but everyone says that, don’t they? ‘Success is not good for you…’

There was more sitting around, waiting to do a gig and drinking too much, and then doing it again for long periods of time, but now, because I do so few gigs, and everyone’s more grown up… well, I say that, but maybe not always grown up… It doesn’t go on forever, but I think if I did a tour that was 100 dates long or something, like we used to, then I’m sure we’d fall out quite quickly.

Did you tour in the States much when you were in Carter?

 

Jim Bob: Yeah – we did. The first time was when we were supporting EMF – we were doing massive venues and staying in posh hotels. That was great, because EMF were number one in America at the time – then we went back and did more university venues. The last American Carter tour we did was awful – no one went to the gigs. I think that was my worst experience of touring – mainly because there was no audience! (Laughs).

The Last Night of the Tour feels like it was written about a contemporary pop star…

Jim Bob: Yeah – I think Taylor Swift set me off on that, even though I imagine she’s nothing like she is in the song. I think I’d seen a lot of those videos where she’s just walking surrounded by photographers, and she’s got about 10 bodyguards, and they’re pushing people out the way. It’s not her [in the song] – it’s about somebody who has to go back [after the tour] and there’s no escape – I imagine it must be a bit like that.

In the final song on Stick, which is There’s Not Enough Space In The Hall, you sing: ‘What are we going to do with all the things we’ve got to say? There aren’t enough hours in the day…’

That made me a laugh, because I thought: ‘You’ve just said it all on two albums!’ Twenty-two songs, but there’s still a lot more to say…

Jim Bob: (Laughs).

In the same song, you say: ‘I’d like to keep my thoughts to myself once in a while or just shut my mouth, but I know that’s not my style…’  Are you opinionated at home? Do you shout at the telly?

Jim Bob: Not as much as I used to. If I was as successful now as I was in Carter, I’d probably get cancelled quite quickly! Or maybe not cancelled, but I think I’d be getting in constant arguments. I have a lot of opinions that I don’t bother sharing because either they’re too nuanced or I’d just end up in an argument with one group of people…

‘You do get a lot of politically-motivated bands but it doesn’t tend to be in the songs… There’s nothing wrong with that, but if you feel that passionate about something, why wouldn’t you sing about it?’

Are you surprised that a lot more contemporary artists don’t tackle politics in their songs? I guess they worry about it from a commercial point of view – trying to sell records. That doesn’t bother you, does it?

Jim Bob: I’m fairly non-specific – it’s not clear what I’m saying, and maybe it never has been. I could be wrong, because obviously I haven’t listened to all music, but I still think that now you do get a lot of politically-motivated bands but it doesn’t tend to be in the songs… There’s nothing wrong with that, but it kind of surprises me. If you feel that passionate about something, why wouldn’t you also sing about it?

Have you got a favourite one of the two new albums? Is it Automatic or Stick?

Jim Bob: If I’m brutally honest, I genuinely like them both. Stick was enjoyable to do because it was just ‘crash, bang, wallop –  here we go…’ I enjoyed that side of it.

I played all the guitar on that one – there’s no Jen Macro on it. I love Jen’s playing – she tends to do things that I’m never going to think of. I’d rather listen to other people than me, so, in a way, my favourite bits are the bits that I’m not on… So, in that sense, I probably prefer Automatic, but only because it’s got less of me on it.

So, what’s next? A triple album?

Jim Bob: Yeah – if only we could sell it.

The last time we spoke was for your 2023 album, Thanks For Reaching Out, which was the final record in a loose, unplanned trilogy. So you’ve done a trilogy and now you’re releasing two albums on the same day…

Jim Bob: Yeah, but when it’s what you do, it’s difficult to see everything in a career-based way and say, ‘Right – what we should do now is take three years and then we’ll do this…’ I’m also pretty old – well, in my mind anyway.

And all my favourite bands, like The Jam, Elvis Costello [and The Attractions] and The Clash, used to bang out an album a year, and they did singles – they didn’t used to wait, did they?

I’ve been reading that [new] Lennon and McCartney book [John and Paul: A Love Story In Songs by Ian Leslie]. It’s really good – they’re doing the stuff that’s taking ages in the studio, and they’re on LSD and they’ve got orchestras coming in… It’d never been done before, but it was only three years after they’d been playing The Cavern, or something…

And when they were doing Rubber Soul and Revolver, they couldn’t replicate some of those songs live…

Jim Bob: It’s like a 25-year career in five years, by modern standards.

‘All my favourite bands, like The Jam, Elvis Costello and The Clash, used to bang out an album a year, and they did singles – they didn’t used to wait, did they?

In the ‘90s, a lot of Britpop bands just stuck strings on some of their songs for the sake of it, when the record companies gave them a bigger studio budget…

Jim Bob: Yeah – really boring strings. I hate it when they do the BBC Proms or whatever, and they’ll have someone like Elbow on, with a 26-piece orchestra… but when it’s done properly, it’s brilliant.

I saw the Quadrophenia ballet [Quadrophenia: A Mod Ballet] and I thought it was brilliant, but then I love Quadrophenia… That had orchestral versions of the songs.

So, maybe your next record could be a triple orchestral ballet soundtrack album?

Jim Bob: That seems the logical next step.

Automatic and Stick are both released on the same day – August 22, on Cherry Red Records.

To launch the albums, Jim Bob and co will be playing Stick in full at Banquet Records in Kingston (August 22) and Automatic in full at Rough Trade East (August 23).

Read the first part of our interview here.

https://jimbob3.bandcamp.com/album/automatic